I know, i know. Words are hard. Let me spell this out for you and see if you can understand what this means.
A 'vaccine passport' as being discussed, is a paper that you must carry and provide as proof that you have your covid vaccines up to date and without it you potentially can't do things, like attend a concert or board a plane.
(PS: I should point out that BOTH parties have been fine with doing the "papers please" for most this year already. Many cities and states have had people tossed in jail for being in public, open areas (that are not crowded) and because they don't have their "I'm essential" papers they go to jail.
A direct and very obvious violation of the 4th Amendment).
I could see something on your actual passport for international air travel but I seriously doubt a "vaccine passport" is going to get much traction anywhere but the right wing whacko conspiracy media.....they love that shit.
So Today is a "wacko conspiracy media" now?
LOL!
I think if you didn't rely on such filtered media, you might have an actual clue on what's going on in the world...
What part of I dont think it will get any traction didnt you understand? Just because there is talk about certain scenarios doesnt mean it will go anywhere... But the right wing whack jobs will grab onto little nuggets like this and see the gestapo behind every bush to ask for your papers, take yoir guns and make you stop saying Merry Christmas. This is what they live for...... You should know... You're one of them.
And I hope you are right. Because this is a very, very dangerous discussion.
Another important issue you have exposed is: me raising the concern and pointing out real issues with this discussion is met by you with contempt. Like this is some alex jones "wacko conspiracy".
Its not. The discussion has been around for a while, but as the actual vaccine inches closer the chatter has increased. Ignore it at your own peril.
Here is a promise from Uncle Stapes. When you want to go to the movies to see Mulan or a Taylor Swift concert nobody is going to ask for your vaccine papers. That is my 100% guaranteed promise.
If you want to fly to Germany or Bukakistan.....they MAY make you get a vaccine stamp in the future.
If this country has any brains they might want to start making visitors from other countries show proof of vaccination when this shit rolls out. Don't have one? Stay fucking home.
Again, I hope you are right.
But realize places like Ticketmaster are taking this vaccine passport discussion very seriously.
You cannot guarantee anything in this arena my friend. For every person in power who is taking draconian action because they think its the right thing to do to save lives, another is doing it solely for the power over their constituents.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:18 am
by Animal
Cassandros wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:08 am
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
you do realize that most every person that has gotten Covid, got it from someone who didn't know they had it at the time. right? i mean there are several days when you first get it that you are contagious, but you don't yet know you have it. by the time you do realize you have it, its too late to warn the people you were around the few days before that. which is why they do contact tracing.
so....... the point of that is that if you get on an airplane, without a vaccine, there is a chance you have the virus and are contagious and don't know it. now that might not be a problerm if you are in a store and wearing a mask or whatever, but if you are on a plane, its impossible to not be in close contact. plus, you are traveling, which means you are going to get off that plane and mingle around in some place that might not want people that could be infectuous.
i'm not a big fan of this idea, but i can damn sure see its logic. and i have to admit it makes sense to me in this isolated situation.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:36 amEEEEEEK I'm not allowed to willfully endanger other people! I'M NOT FREE!!!!
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
Cassandros wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:08 am
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
you do realize that most every person that has gotten Covid, got it from someone who didn't know they had it at the time. right? i mean there are several days when you first get it that you are contagious, but you don't yet know you have it. by the time you do realize you have it, its too late to warn the people you were around the few days before that. which is why they do contact tracing.
so....... the point of that is that if you get on an airplane, without a vaccine, there is a chance you have the virus and are contagious and don't know it. now that might not be a problerm if you are in a store and wearing a mask or whatever, but if you are on a plane, its impossible to not be in close contact. plus, you are traveling, which means you are going to get off that plane and mingle around in some place that might not want people that could be infectuous.
i'm not a big fan of this idea, but i can damn sure see its logic. and i have to admit it makes sense to me in this isolated situation.
That's the story.
But think about it. Right now they story is planes are safe, just wear a mask. So, the idea that you have to be vaccinated to fly is already proven to be bullshit.
And, the core point remains. Lets say the story of how contagious covid is is spot on true... the whole point of vaccines is to protect the person getting it. If we are to use reason and logic then we have to admit that forcing Sara to have her vaccine papers up to date to protect Bill is bullshit.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:28 am
by Animal
Cassandros wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:25 am
That's the story.
But think about it. Right now they story is planes are safe, just wear a mask. So, the idea that you have to be vaccinated to fly is already proven to be bullshit.
And, the core point remains. Lets say the story of how contagious covid is is spot on true... the whole point of vaccines is to protect the person getting it. If we are to use reason and logic then we have to admit that forcing Sara to have her vaccine papers up to date to protect Bill is bullshit.
i really think you can understand the difference in a vaccination and a mask, right? you can take a mask off or wear it wrong. you can't unvaccinate yourself.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:36 amEEEEEEK I'm not allowed to willfully endanger other people! I'M NOT FREE!!!!
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
The current mortality rate in America is at 3%.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:32 am
by Animal
i'd be willing to have vaccination flights and non-vaccination flights. same with movies. and let the free market determine which one the consumers want. its really just not that big of a deal to me. if i don't want to fly without everyone having a vaccine and they dont' require it, then i just wouldn't fly. if its the other way around and they demand one and i don't want one, then i wouldn't fly. its just not that big of a deal to me.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:36 amEEEEEEK I'm not allowed to willfully endanger other people! I'M NOT FREE!!!!
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
The current mortality rate in America is at 3%.
Using "Closed cases" is really cherry picking statistics, huh?
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:35 am
by megman
Every country should put U.S. Americans on a no-fly list.
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
The current mortality rate in America is at 3%.
Using "Closed cases" is really cherry picking statistics, huh?
No. It's the only true measure. And you know it.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:44 am
by B-Tender
megman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:35 am
Every country should put U.S. Americans on a no-fly list.
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
The current mortality rate in America is at 3%.
Using "Closed cases" is really cherry picking statistics, huh?
No. It's the only true measure. And you know it.
So that doesn't include all the people who got it, had moderate to now symptoms, and never sought medical care. Right?
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:36 amEEEEEEK I'm not allowed to willfully endanger other people! I'M NOT FREE!!!!
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
Do you understand that if 1% of the entire US died tonight you wouldn't even notice a difference in traffic tomorrow morning?
People have a hard time really understanding numbers. Half a million die to heart disease yearly, no fucks given. Another half million die to cancer annually, again, no fucks given. 40k die do to complications from being fat every month, and yet again no fucks are given.
But a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate (among those who are in the highest risk categories I might add) and suddenly 200,000* covid deaths is too much? Now we need to have conversations of forcing vaccines on all people and threatening to curtail their liberty if they don't comply?
That, sir, is idiotic.
Shall we do the same with heart disease? To protect people from their heart we create a 'fitness passport' and if they haven't eaten enough healthy meals and done enough exercise that week they are not allowed to eat at Burger King or buy ice cream at the grocery store?
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:50 am
by Animal
Reservoir Dog wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:36 am
No. It's the only true measure. And you know it.
there have been nearly 15 million cases. a case only lasts 10 days (per the CDC). Do you honestly think there are 7 million people at home sick right now with Covid? Or do you think, maybe, that there is no way to determine who is "recovered"? they don't test people to determine if they are recovered.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 2:36 amEEEEEEK I'm not allowed to willfully endanger other people! I'M NOT FREE!!!!
This literal makes no sense to the topic of enforcing a 'vaccine passport'.
Care to try again, or is "adulting" too hard for you today?
i think what he means is that this isn't really the same thing as just a basic freedom of doing what you want. in this situation, you "might" be infected with a deadly virus and not know it and they are betting that a vaccine (or proof of one) would insure that you are safe and not infectuous. Sort of like having you walk through a metal detector before getting on a plane.
i'm guessing, though.
I doubt it was, but it might be now that you helped him along. lol
Naturally the obvious counter thought is: vaccines are never 100%, there are cases of vaccines spreading disease, and the principle idea of a vaccine is to protect the person getting it. Not those around them. (Also, I personally have a real hard time calling a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate "deadly". Ebola is deadly. Covid might be dangerous to some, but its not inherently deadly. But I digress).
If you fear covid (or the flu, or whatever disease there is a vaccine for) you get the vaccine and hope the side effects aren't worse than the disease you are trying to protect against. How in the hell does preventing people from participating in social events or traveling if they are not vaccinated to the level the government/business decides make any one else there "safe"?
It doesn't.
Do you understand that 1% makes it 10x more deadly than the seasonal flu? Can you understand the staggering amount of death 1% is if not combatted? You definitely belong in this section....
You have plenty of like minded retards to keep you company
Do you understand that if 1% of the entire US died tonight you wouldn't even notice a difference in traffic tomorrow morning?
People have a hard time really understanding numbers. Half a million die to heart disease yearly, no fucks given. Another half million die to cancer annually, again, no fucks given. 40k die do to complications from being fat every month, and yet again no fucks are given.
But a virus with a less than 1% fatality rate (among those who are in the highest risk categories I might add) and suddenly 200,000* covid deaths is too much? Now we need to have conversations of forcing vaccines on all people and threatening to curtail their liberty if they don't comply?
That, sir, is idiotic.
Shall we do the same with heart disease? To protect people from their heart we create a 'fitness passport' and if they haven't eaten enough healthy meals and done enough exercise that week they are not allowed to eat at Burger King or buy ice cream at the grocery store?
Antknot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:20 am
You don't think guaranteed government sales allowed them to get favorable loans? Thus allowing them to benefit from Warp SPeed?
He's just scared to death that Trump might end up with a check mark for something good.
I don't give a crap who gets credit for the Biden Vaccine.
did you hear that President BIden just unveiled his Covid-19 Plan that starts the very minute he takes the oath of office. He's going to ask everyone to wear a mask for 100 days.
Finally. a plan.
Dude. Thats just so they can control you long enough to take away your guns and injected their tracking chip. DONT FALL FOR IT SHEEPLES!!!
Antknot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:20 am
You don't think guaranteed government sales allowed them to get favorable loans? Thus allowing them to benefit from Warp SPeed?
He's just scared to death that Trump might end up with a check mark for something good.
I don't give a crap who gets credit for the Biden Vaccine.
did you hear that President BIden just unveiled his Covid-19 Plan that starts the very minute he takes the oath of office. He's going to ask everyone to wear a mask for 100 days.
Finally. a plan.
Dude. Thats just so they can control you long enough to take away your guns and injected their tracking chip. DONT FALL FOR IT SHEEPLES!!!
Yeah, we should just keep on doing the apparent Chumpy plan, and keep on having big meetings and parties with lots of unmasked people, especially indoors, and not caring about all the people who get the plague! Because FREEDOMS!
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:45 pm
by Animal
its weird how after an election a "national mask mandate" turns into "I'm going to ask everyone to wear a mask".
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:46 pm
by Biker
Animal wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:45 pm
its weird how after an election a "national mask mandate" turns into "I'm going to ask everyone to wear a mask".
Just for 100 days in order to flatten the curve.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:48 pm
by Stapes
It's more than the fat bastard in the White House ever did
Animal wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:45 pm
its weird how after an election a "national mask mandate" turns into "I'm going to ask everyone to wear a mask".
Just for 100 days in order to flatten the curve.
or just until we can start seeing some progress from the Warp Speed vaccines.
Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
Posted: Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:53 pm
by FSchmertz
Stapes wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 4:48 pm
It's more than the fat bastard in the White House ever did
It's not so much he didn't ask people to wear masks and socially distance.
It's that he mocked anyone that was trying to do that or encouraging it (still does btw). That's reprehensible.
You Chumpers worship a guy that couldn't care less about you idiots.
Using "Closed cases" is really cherry picking statistics, huh? 
