Biden's Afghan failure

[Biker]

Vietnam shadow hangs over Biden decision on Afghanistan

President Biden is facing a potential foreign policy and humanitarian catastrophe in Afghanistan as the Taliban makes rapid gains, capturing major cities and prompting concerns over the safety of U.S. diplomatic personnel and civilians on the ground.


The Taliban took control of Kandahar and Herat on Thursday, the second- and third-largest cities in Afghanistan after Kabul, followed by Lashkar Gar on Friday. The Biden administration is sending about 3,000 troops to the country to help evacuate diplomats from the U.S. Embassy in Kabul, as well as Afghans who have applied for special immigrant visas for helping the United States during the war.

Despite the quickly deteriorating situation, Biden is poised to see through the withdrawal of U.S. troops by the end of August. The White House believes it's the best move in a situation with no perfect solution, and officials believe it is a decision that will garner public support even as it attracts intense scrutiny from Republicans and national security hawks.

But deep concerns have been raised by figures in the wider national security establishment, and administration figures on Friday were struggling with comparisons between Kabul and the fall of Saigon.

"This is a government we built, financed, and protected," said a former State Department official who served across multiple Democratic and Republican administrations. "And we're walking away from them and in the process we're saying they're not up to the fight. I think the messaging that's being done right now is really worrisome because it's like, 'it's not our fault.' "

Statements Biden made just last month that compared the situations of Afghanistan and Vietnam are also coming under new scrutiny.

In July, Biden defended his decision to withdraw troops and rejected the notion that a Taliban takeover of the country was "inevitable."

"The Taliban is not the North Vietnamese Army. They're not remotely comparable in terms of capability," Biden said during a speech in the White House East Room. "There's going to be no circumstances where you're going to see people being lifted off the roof of an embassy in the United States from Afghanistan."

The White House has offered a consistent message on the withdrawal, even as the Taliban advances at a rate that has astonished many experts on the region.

"Ultimately, the Afghan National Security Defense Forces have the equipment, numbers, and training to fight back. They have what they need," press secretary Jen Psaki said Wednesday, echoing Biden's own words a day earlier. "What they need to determine is if they have the political will to fight back, and if they have the ability to unite as a - as leaders to fight back. And that's really where it stands at this point."

So far, it appears the U.S. bet on Afghan forces is not paying off.

The Taliban has seized control of multiple provincial capitals and major cities, and only three major cities in Afghanistan, including the capital of Kabul, remain under government control.

In a sign of looming concerns over Kabul, a city of more than 4 million people, the Biden administration announced Thursday it will send about 3,000 troops to help evacuate diplomats from the U.S. Embassy there. The U.S. had about 2,500 to 3,500 troops in Afghanistan before Biden ordered a withdrawal. About 650 of those remain in the country securing the embassy and airport.

Biden was briefed Friday by his national security team on the latest developments in Afghanistan, a White House official said.

The White House seems to also be banking on continuing public support for ending the war in Afghanistan. Recent polls show support for Biden's position.

A poll conducted July 7-26 by the Chicago Council found 70 percent of Americans, including 56 percent of Republicans surveyed, support withdrawing U.S. forces from Afghanistan by Sept. 11, while 29 percent oppose doing so. A May poll from Quinnipiac University found 62 percent of Americans supported that timeline.



"I give him a lot of credit for the way he described his decision in a transparent way and said, 'Look, we've done all we can do,'" said Emily Harding, a senior fellow at the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

"Now, what I also think he's banking on is the American people don't care about what happens next. And I think it's going to be very hard to ignore a lot of the imagery that's going to come out of Afghanistan in the next few months," added Harding, who previously worked as a deputy staff director for the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.

Biden inherited a Trump-era agreement in which the Taliban would uphold certain commitments such as denying safe haven for al Qaeda, and the U.S. would withdraw from Afghanistan by May 1. At a time when the new administration was undoing orders of the old one almost daily, some questioned why the agreement to leave Afghanistan remained in place.

The president in April announced the U.S. would be out of Afghanistan by Sept. 11, a date that was later moved up to the end of August.

Biden, who as recently as Tuesday said he has no regrets about the withdrawal, has remained steadfast in his commitment to end America's longest running war, believing another generation of soldiers should not be sent to fight a battle with no clear endgame in sight. Some in the White House believe the chaos that has unfolded in recent days only underscores the futile nature of remaining in Afghanistan.

"The Taliban's rapid gains in Afghanistan underscore the futility of permanent occupation," Justin Amash, a former independent congressman, wrote in a tweet shared by White House chief of staff Ron Klain. "The United States wasn't able to meaningfully shape circumstances through 20 years of war. We'd have seen the same results had we pulled out 15 years ago or 15 years from now. End the wars."

[Biker]

‘We Are Powerless’: Joe Biden Official Deletes Social Media Post Admitting Failure in Afghanistan

A senior Biden official at the State Department expressed sadness Friday that the administration was “powerless” to protect women and girls in Afghanistan from the Taliban.

Deputy Assistant Secretary in the State Department Bureau of European and Eurasian Affairs Molly Montgomery shared her thoughts on Twitter early Friday morning after reports demonstrated the swiftness of the Taliban takeover of Afghanistan.

“Woke up with a heavy heart, thinking about all the Afghan women and girls I worked with during my time in Kabul,” she wrote on her personal account. “They were the beneficiaries of many of the gains we made, and now they stand to lose everything.”

She appeared to express frustration that the Biden administration was unable to help them.

“We empowered them to lead, and now we are powerless to protect them,” she wrote.

The Twitter post disappeared from the site later in the day, but not before reporters took screenshots of it.

“This deleted tweet from a senior Biden State Department official captures the private feelings of many others,” Axios reporter Jonathan Swan wrote.

The sentiment Montgomery voiced opposes the message from the White House, insisting the president has no regrets about his decision to withdraw troops from Afghanistan.

“The President is firmly focused on how we can continue to execute an orderly drawdown and protect our men and women serving in Afghanistan,” White House press secretary Jen Psaki told Fox News. “You heard him earlier this week: he does not regret his decision.”

Biden denied he would bear responsibility for a Taliban takeover of Afghanistan during an interview with CBS News anchor Margaret Brennan during his presidential campaign.

“Do I bear responsibility? Zero responsibility,” he said in February 2020.

[CHEEZY17]

Shit Show Joe.

[Stapes]

I blame Bush............. and Biker

[Antknot]

Getting out of Afghanistan is a good thing.

The decision to have a hard date to get out is a good thing.

Telling everybody about the date, Is not a good thing.

Failing to have the pieces in place to get out is a bad thing.

This is worsr than a bad thing, this is a failure on so many levels.

[AnalHamster]

It was the trump surrender plan, though Biden shares the blame for carrying it through. If there were any blame, which i'd say there isn't. Biden would have left a decade ago and the result would have been exactly the same back then. Twenty years got us nothing, twenty more would have got us the same.

[CentralTexasCrude]

The main thing about Afghanistan going way back into prehistory, they were always a "crossroads". Trading routes( China-Middle East/ Europe)/ (Indian Ocean/ Caucus/ Russia), rampaging armies marching through toward somewhere else, endless sectional fighting. No country will come to their defense because they have nothing of value other than their land.

they have rare earth metal reserves and massive amounts of poppy fields and just 'OK' hash .It's one country with half dozen districts that prefer to rule themselves and none of them recognize a central government-ever. So the USA left as did every other country that tried to tame it for over 300 yrs.Nobody will come to their defense because it's senseless and they want a keeper not a defender. fuk them.

Ok, I can agree with everything you said, except the 300 year timeline. That is totally Euro/ Western centric. That kind of thing has been going on for probably 3,000 years, well before Alexander's conquests. Has anybody actually looked at the faces of the Afghan people. I find it fascinating. People with Chinese, Mongol features. People with Indian, Middle east faces. Slavs, Caucus, even red haired obviously European features. 3,000 years of conquering and raping.

[Charliesheen]

It doesn’t help when your war partner believes in buggering children.

[CentralTexasCrude]

[Reservoir Dog]

.

[fouts]

The main thing about Afghanistan going way back into prehistory, they were always a "crossroads". Trading routes( China-Middle East/ Europe)/ (Indian Ocean/ Caucus/ Russia), rampaging armies marching through toward somewhere else, endless sectional fighting. No country will come to their defense because they have nothing of value other than their land.

they have rare earth metal reserves and massive amounts of poppy fields and just 'OK' hash .It's one country with half dozen districts that prefer to rule themselves and none of them recognize a central government-ever. So the USA left as did every other country that tried to tame it for over 300 yrs.Nobody will come to their defense because it's senseless and they want a keeper not a defender. fuk them.

Ok, I can agree with everything you said, except the 300 year timeline. That is totally Euro/ Western centric. That kind of thing has been going on for probably 3,000 years, well before Alexander's conquests. Has anybody actually looked at the faces of the Afghan people. I find it fascinating. People with Chinese, Mongol features. People with Indian, Middle east faces. Slavs, Caucus, even red haired obviously European features. 3,000 years of conquering and raping.

bad things happen to good people since forever. I suspect the English had something to do with their fragment country. The English had a habit of drawing new borders as they occupied the Middle east no matter how many centuries it was otherwise. Afgans are in real trouble now.They sucked Russia for a few years, USA for 20 yrs. there is nobody left.To the Afgans I say good luck and good night

[necronomous]

I remember when someone up here complained about this under Trump. Wonder if they will do the same now.

[CentralTexasCrude]

The main thing about Afghanistan going way back into prehistory, they were always a "crossroads". Trading routes( China-Middle East/ Europe)/ (Indian Ocean/ Caucus/ Russia), rampaging armies marching through toward somewhere else, endless sectional fighting. No country will come to their defense because they have nothing of value other than their land.

they have rare earth metal reserves and massive amounts of poppy fields and just 'OK' hash .It's one country with half dozen districts that prefer to rule themselves and none of them recognize a central government-ever. So the USA left as did every other country that tried to tame it for over 300 yrs.Nobody will come to their defense because it's senseless and they want a keeper not a defender. fuk them.

Ok, I can agree with everything you said, except the 300 year timeline. That is totally Euro/ Western centric. That kind of thing has been going on for probably 3,000 years, well before Alexander's conquests. Has anybody actually looked at the faces of the Afghan people. I find it fascinating. People with Chinese, Mongol features. People with Indian, Middle east faces. Slavs, Caucus, even red haired obviously European features. 3,000 years of conquering and raping.

bad things happen to good people since forever. I suspect the English had something to do with their fragment country. The English had a habit of drawing new borders as they occupied the Middle east no matter how many centuries it was otherwise. Afgans are in real trouble now.They sucked Russia for a few years, USA for 20 yrs. there is nobody left.To the Afgans I say good luck and good night

I doubt the Afghans feel themselves in trouble. Same old same old for centuries. Been at the crossroads of empire clashes and religious wars for well over 2 millennials. The British (with the French not far behind) are almost wholly responsible for almost every problem in the Middle East for the last century. Carving up the Ottomans after WWI, they both just drew lines on a map and said "That's a Country"- Iraq/ "That's a Country"- Syria. No consideration to ancient and religious borders. I believe an arrogant British official said to Sunnis/ Shiites official quarrelling over some issue "Can't we get along like good Christians?". Got way worse after WWII when they just abandoned their Empires due to bankruptcy. I don't don't think Afghanistan was affected by all that. Those other countries had strategic values (oil, sea ports, etc). Afghanistan doesn't have any of those. I'm rather surprised Pakistan hasn't intervened.

[Reservoir Dog]

.

[AnalHamster]

It doesn’t help when your war partner believes in buggering children.

Also when your war partner steals the money given to them to pay the soldiers meant to do the fighting. Can't really blame the poor bastards for taking the deal of not dying and also finally getting paid when the alternative is fighting and dying in a hopeless battle with no supplies when you haven't been paid in months. I would.

[CHEEZY17]

This fucking shit show gets worse by the day. What an embarrassment.

[Charliesheen]

That trillion had to be spent somewhere.

[necronomous]

[fouts]

The main thing about Afghanistan going way back into prehistory, they were always a "crossroads". Trading routes( China-Middle East/ Europe)/ (Indian Ocean/ Caucus/ Russia), rampaging armies marching through toward somewhere else, endless sectional fighting. No country will come to their defense because they have nothing of value other than their land.

they have rare earth metal reserves and massive amounts of poppy fields and just 'OK' hash .It's one country with half dozen districts that prefer to rule themselves and none of them recognize a central government-ever. So the USA left as did every other country that tried to tame it for over 300 yrs.Nobody will come to their defense because it's senseless and they want a keeper not a defender. fuk them.

Ok, I can agree with everything you said, except the 300 year timeline. That is totally Euro/ Western centric. That kind of thing has been going on for probably 3,000 years, well before Alexander's conquests. Has anybody actually looked at the faces of the Afghan people. I find it fascinating. People with Chinese, Mongol features. People with Indian, Middle east faces. Slavs, Caucus, even red haired obviously European features. 3,000 years of conquering and raping.

bad things happen to good people since forever. I suspect the English had something to do with their fragment country. The English had a habit of drawing new borders as they occupied the Middle east no matter how many centuries it was otherwise. Afgans are in real trouble now.They sucked Russia for a few years, USA for 20 yrs. there is nobody left.To the Afgans I say good luck and good night

I doubt the Afghans feel themselves in trouble. Same old same old for centuries. Been at the crossroads of empire clashes and religious wars for well over 2 millennials. The British (with the French not far behind) are almost wholly responsible for almost every problem in the Middle East for the last century. Carving up the Ottomans after WWI, they both just drew lines on a map and said "That's a Country"- Iraq/ "That's a Country"- Syria. No consideration to ancient and religious borders. I believe an arrogant British official said to Sunnis/ Shiites official quarrelling over some issue "Can't we get along like good Christians?". Got way worse after WWII when they just abandoned their Empires due to bankruptcy. I don't don't think Afghanistan was affected by all that. Those other countries had strategic values (oil, sea ports, etc). Afghanistan doesn't have any of those. I'm rather surprised Pakistan hasn't intervened.

in a country where a flush toilet is a luxury and a 3rd grade education is genius level very little will bother them-fuk them

[CHEEZY17]

Shit Show Joe.

[Charliesheen]

They’ll always have those to enhance life in the west.

[CentralTexasCrude]

The main thing about Afghanistan going way back into prehistory, they were always a "crossroads". Trading routes( China-Middle East/ Europe)/ (Indian Ocean/ Caucus/ Russia), rampaging armies marching through toward somewhere else, endless sectional fighting. No country will come to their defense because they have nothing of value other than their land.

they have rare earth metal reserves and massive amounts of poppy fields and just 'OK' hash .It's one country with half dozen districts that prefer to rule themselves and none of them recognize a central government-ever. So the USA left as did every other country that tried to tame it for over 300 yrs.Nobody will come to their defense because it's senseless and they want a keeper not a defender. fuk them.

Ok, I can agree with everything you said, except the 300 year timeline. That is totally Euro/ Western centric. That kind of thing has been going on for probably 3,000 years, well before Alexander's conquests. Has anybody actually looked at the faces of the Afghan people. I find it fascinating. People with Chinese, Mongol features. People with Indian, Middle east faces. Slavs, Caucus, even red haired obviously European features. 3,000 years of conquering and raping.

bad things happen to good people since forever. I suspect the English had something to do with their fragment country. The English had a habit of drawing new borders as they occupied the Middle east no matter how many centuries it was otherwise. Afgans are in real trouble now.They sucked Russia for a few years, USA for 20 yrs. there is nobody left.To the Afgans I say good luck and good night

I doubt the Afghans feel themselves in trouble. Same old same old for centuries. Been at the crossroads of empire clashes and religious wars for well over 2 millennials. The British (with the French not far behind) are almost wholly responsible for almost every problem in the Middle East for the last century. Carving up the Ottomans after WWI, they both just drew lines on a map and said "That's a Country"- Iraq/ "That's a Country"- Syria. No consideration to ancient and religious borders. I believe an arrogant British official said to Sunnis/ Shiites official quarrelling over some issue "Can't we get along like good Christians?". Got way worse after WWII when they just abandoned their Empires due to bankruptcy. I don't don't think Afghanistan was affected by all that. Those other countries had strategic values (oil, sea ports, etc). Afghanistan doesn't have any of those. I'm rather surprised Pakistan hasn't intervened.

in a country where a flush toilet is a luxury and a 3rd grade education is genius level very little will bother them-fuk them

I have nothing to back it up, but I have a hunch Pakistanian forces are about to invade from the South to stabilize the situation. No idea why I'm thinking that.

[Charliesheen]

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/Cascade/ind ... 31a74cb38f

I read this whole article and it supports your claim. Then, at the very end it says the Taliban collects a 20% tax on opium.

[Charliesheen]

Don’t care if it’s a repost. You idiots voted for this demented retread.

[QillerDaemon]

I have nothing to back it up, but I have a hunch Pakistanian forces are about to invade from the South to stabilize the situation. No idea why I'm thinking that.

Pakistan has its own problem with a home-grown Taliban group in the west of their country. The Paki and the Afghan Taliban are not exactly the same, and at best could be considered "frenemies", both at odds with one another and yet support each other. If the Afghan Taliban actually take over all of Afghanistan, it could spell trouble for at least the west part of Pakistan should the two groups realign to some degree.

The Taliban in Afghanistan helped inspire the deadly Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan, more commonly known simply as the Pakistani Taliban. The leaders of the two groups are reportedly at odds and don't share common goals. Even so, "if there is a Taliban government in Afghanistan, certainly that's going to embolden the [Pakistani Taliban]," Madiha Afzal, the David M. Rubenstein fellow in foreign policy at the Brookings Institution, tells NPR.

Haqqani, the former ambassador who is now director for South and Central Asia at the Hudson Institute, writes in Foreign Affairs that "Islamist extremism has already divided Pakistani society along sectarian lines, and the ascendance of Afghan Islamists next door will only embolden radicals at home."

He says that Pakistan's "risky game" of supporting the Taliban while trying to maintain good relations with Washington "was never going to prove sustainable in the long term."

"Pakistan has managed to kick the can down the road for a long time. Soon, however, it will reach the end of the road," he writes.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/14/10273759 ... a-pakistan